Idea: A Tiberiumweb community mod Options

[jadems]

Oooh, 'adviser' just like Kane in Red Alert, adviser to Stalin..

But don't forget! It's community mod, LKO, there isn't much to do as we can use stuff that's already been made.
And maybe we can get PPM to join! More stuff to use and more minds to think!
As for me, I'll think of more stuff to put in!

[Lightstorm]

Oooh, 'adviser' just like Kane in Red Alert, adviser to Stalin..

But don't forget! It's community mod, LKO, there isn't much to do as we can use stuff that's already been made.
And maybe we can get PPM to join! More stuff to use and more minds to think!
As for me, I'll think of more stuff to put in!

no.


i really don't want PPM getting into this, this should be our mod.

[Lin Kuei Ominae]

Agree! no ppm please.

[Team Black]

heh, I was almost thinking of making something of a modding competition between tibwebbers and PPMers (the guys who aren't in tibweb)
That's why I put "how to get Final Dawn on its feet" topic there, to try and get some interest back into it, but with no luck.
The way I see it, is even though they have a 5 year head start on us, we'd still win.

The thing that'll make this mod work isn't unnecessarily modding ability, but cooperation, respect, and friendliness, and PPM isn't exactly the best place to find those types.
There are a few people on PPM that would be cool if they could do something for this mod, like IVI, SaneDisruption, and Gangster~
But yeah, tibweb has more than enough talented people, we shouldn't need to go knocking on PPM's door-

This post has been edited by Team Black: May 15 2007, 03:14 PM

[jadems]

Okies, my bad.
Now that you mention it, PPM is kinda vague and the people aren't that motivated...
Well, we got that outta the way

[Lightstorm]

good, we also need to consider whether or not we'll be making a campaign for this, and if so how advanced will it be? will the scrin be playable in this hypothetical campaign? (i hope so)

This post has been edited by Team Black: May 21 2007, 10:03 PM

[Clazzy]

You don't even have a leader yet and most of the ideas you've posted aren't possible. Spend a week or two brainstorming ideas, come up with preliminary ideas for how the sides should be structured and what style of units/weapons they should have. See what can and can't be implemented (just to tell you now, you cannot have an upgrade as a prerequisite, at least not in TS). Get somebody with good ini editing skills to start organising the rules.ini (at least naming units and putting everything in a coherent order) then finally you'd be ready to consider having a forum. You can't throw around random ideas and say you have a mod, you need to actually sit down and build the ideas together into a unified form.

[Team Black]

I'm the leader.

see, this thread isn't exactly intended for brainstorming ideas on what the mod will be, that's what the forum will be for.
With a forum, it will be better to organize and address these ideas - containing them all in this single thread is getting it messy and disorganized.

This thread was made for two purposes:
1. to get feedback on the idea
2. to plan on how to go about it

We have positive feedback now, and I've made a plan to go about it, and yes, I'll have time now to lead it up, now that school is done for me after this week.

[Team Black]

Holy goodness LKO those are frikkin awesome ideas!

Heh, so the scrin could have starcraft-esque mobile buildings, that's totally amazing!

Okay people, "Shouting" (meaning capitals, large fonts etc..) about it won't make it happen any more quickly.

People keep saying the mod isn't organized enough, even though I've already described my plans to go about it-
None of the mod's critics have showed any signs of attention to this, which is frustrating.
By using bold/itallic, I was hoping it would make this more noticable-

Has anyone actually sent a PM to DvD yet?.

yes

Remember that DvD is not on the forums 24/7, he may not have had time to do anything.

True, but the only thing he said is "No, because the plan isn't concrete" - which isn't a sufficient response in my opinion.
Assuming he even read my plan for the TCM forum, he didn't address any of the ideas I mentioned on how to run the TCM forum, what would work and what wouldn't-
This is also frustrating.

You could try contacting him via MSN, it will probably be faster that way

wow, I don't know why I didn't think of that OK he's added now

Python also has control over that sort of thing - if you cannot contact DvD, try him.

Python seemed to me as being less available to reach than DVD - but yeah that's a good idea too.



see, theres' two different topics in this thread, one is trying to plan the forum, and the other is trying to plan the mod itself. the longer we wait to put the forum up, the more disorganized this thread will become.

Organize it into sub-forums, something like:

Voxels: -(locked-sticky) voxel list for the mod
-voxel submissions in individual threads

SHP: --(locked-sticky) shp unit list for the mod
-(locked-sticky) buildings list for the mod
-(locked-sticky) terrain..
-shp submissions in individual threads

Ideas: -(locked-sticky) ideas to be used in the mod
-All ideas discussed here

Applications: -(locked-sticky) list of things the mod needs..
-(locked-sticky) Member list: people affirmed to be in the mod, and their jobs
-applications here in individual threads
Here you can apply to contribute to the mod. etc. etc..


All the things in the "lock-sticky's" will be the things affirmed to be put in the mod, (controlled by whoever is leading the mod). the rest will be in individual threads (with a poll or something perhaps, on whether or not they should be used)

Here's my plan:
Once the forum is up, (I'll moderate), from there we can decide things, probably in this order:
1. Applications thread: Discuss leaders, when a decent team is formed then proceed to

2. Ideas thread: decide on the direction of the mod. Come up with a list of what is needed (this might take a while), then

3. Open Applications: individuals pick something on the list to work on, and apply by showing previous work, with respect to what they are applying for (i.e. show a voxel they've already made if it's a voxel that they'd want to work on) - Community might have a vote on whether or not it should be accepted, although vote or not, the leaders will ultimately decide whether or not to accept the application.

4. Once a job is accepted, it is recorded somewhere, and the one doing the work will post progress, when available, in the respectable thread (voxels in the voxel thread, etc.)

5. When it's agreed on as 'complete', then it will be submitted to the leaders in PM or something.

6. list of completed work will be posted in a sticky (probably locked, too) at the top of each sub-forum.

the current "TCM" thread is ONLY to get feedback on the idea, and to form a plan on how to go about it.
What's happening now is an explosion of ideas, and in order to organize them and get community feedback, I'm going to need a forum.
Not only that, but we haven't even decided on a group of leaders-
People are anticipating the mod and are jumping the gun with all kinds of ideas, which is why I'm requesting a forum before it gets too chaotic, which will defeat the purpose of your hesitation in the first place

This post has been edited by Team Black: May 16 2007, 01:33 PM

[Team Black]

It might defeat the purpose oh having it be a tibweb community mod.
I think it would be only necessary to have the support of its webmasters, and be hosted on the site that it's said to be representing.

Otherwise, it might end up dangerously becoming something of an LKO-TeamBlack-Lightstorm-Jadams mod, and ditch the original intentions entirely. (although that might make a pretty interesting team XD)

[jadems]

YAY, I'm in...

And can't we just use existing vxls and shps and say that makes it a 'Community mod'?
Seriously, we should do that, plus we'll get ppl to make stuff for us. Like that dude that makes maps.
Meanwhile I wanna check out that undeploy buildings with upgrade logic.

Update: Yup, i tried, when you undeploy an upgraded building it sells the upgrades.

This post has been edited by jadems: May 16 2007, 09:50 PM

[Team Black]

keep in mind we're still in the what if stages - technically, the mod hasn't started yet

When the forum is up, then it'll be better organized. The goal is, to have everyone in the community be submitting ideas.

This post has been edited by Team Black: May 16 2007, 11:09 PM

[Lightstorm]

i say if they don't give us a forum we just take over the TD mod forum. nothings there anyway.

This post has been edited by Lightstorm: May 17 2007, 02:13 AM

[Team Black]

LOL

Well see, without DVD/Python's support, a Tiberiumweb Community mod really won't get anyone anywhere
they are the webmasters, after all

Patience, young padowan.

[Nod Strike]

So, this is happening?

[Team Black]

I'm beginning to think that this is going nowhere

My recent conversations with the admin tell me that they don't exactly hold this idea in high regard, and the chances of getting a forum for this are likely slim to none.
We probably have some spammers to thank for that

I'm beginning to lose faith in this mod as a community project.

What I'm thinking, since we have too many good ideas to simply abandon the project, is to just to host this mod somewhere else, like -- dare I say it -- PPM.
We have a decent crew here, Lightstorm is great with ideas and concepts, LKO (do I even need to say it? ) IS amazing with shp, voxel, and coding, I'm into maps, voxel, coding, Photoshop, and audio, and Jadems is good at repeating all our ideas back to us
Anyone else who might want to join (from tibweb) will be welcome, I guess. We'll get a few models together and start a forum on PPM, I'll lead.

What do you guys think?

This post has been edited by Team Black: May 20 2007, 05:51 AM

[jadems]

I was going to apologies of the support thread but I think it would be counted as spamming... SORRY I'll be good

And how am I repeating ideas, just complaining about them and trying to perfect them
and I have more ideas like exploiting veteranship. Make the Scrin start of pretty ill-equipped and make their point cost low so that they gain veteranship easier and give them way better weapons and abilities. I've had too much WC3

[Clazzy]

THEN START DOING SOMETHING. You don't need a forum to put everything together, right now you all just have random little thoughts and that counts as a bloody mod. Get full details on all the sides, make the units and start concepts for stuff, THEN the admins might care. Virtually every single post is just you whining about the fact you don't have a forum yet. Rather than complaining, just get to a point where you can actually say you have something that can be played or shown in screenshots along with information about it. If you're going to lead a mod, actually do your job and be a leader rather than Mr. Ask for a forum at every bloody opportunity.
By the way, it's utterly stupid to start with mission ideas now when you haven't even started coding, voxellising or SHPing. They are the key three things to any decent mod, so get cracking.

[Lin Kuei Ominae]

I'm beginning to lose faith in this mod as a community project.

We have a decent crew here, Lightstorm is great with ideas and concepts, LKO (do I even need to say it? ) IS amazing with shp, voxel, and coding, I'm into maps, voxel, coding, Photoshop, and audio, and Jadems is good at repeating all our ideas back to us
Anyone else who might want to join (from tibweb) will be welcome, I guess. We'll get a few models together and start a forum on PPM, I'll lead.

What do you guys think?

that is exact the point i wanted to avoid. Many people start, but only few others and me left. (after all i didn't wanted to make all new units and buildings)
I think Clazzy is right.
What's needed, is a concrete unit/building plan for the sides. So i think we should make Nails with Heads concerning the scrin. (if this phrase exists in english too). GDI and Nod can stay for now, how they are.
The ideas are ok, now see how they can be coded.

And also some more people of the community are needed. If nobody else wants to join, this project is doomed to failure. sorry

This post has been edited by Lin Kuei Ominae: May 20 2007, 12:58 PM

[Creagor]

Well, Ive allready had a chat with Team Black via PM, so he knows about this allready - I'll provide assistance with an executable/Dynamic-link library once it gets going a bit, possibly followed by some terrain/simple SHP work when I get more time to do things.

[Team Black]

I don't think people are understanding that I'm not exactly taking the traditional approach to making a mod, since this won't exactly be an ordinary mod.
What I've been trying to explain is that I INTEND TO USE THE FORUM TO PLAN THE MOD.

I've been looking through PPM TFD and learning possible problems as to why the mod lost its momentum...
From what I can tell, it lacked a lot of organization - there wasn't a definite way someone could see exactly what the mod needed, what direction it was going.
This is why I's propose that every submission be represented in a thread, to discuss & decide whether or not it should be used.
All submissions that are decided to be in the mod will be PMed to the leaders, and represented in a locked - sticky at the top of the respective sub-forum.
for example:
VOXEL FORUM
pinned: All voxels used in the TCM (locked) - All voxels OK'd by the leaders are listed here, with a screenie of each, and maybe a link to the topic.
-voxel submission (complete & accepted)
-voxel submission (WIP)
-voxel submission (complete & pending...)

This is also so that any point in time, anyone can look and see the current state of the mod.



Another issue with Final Dawn is that there were alot of newbies there trying to contribute stuff that . . .well, just stank, not to be rude.

This is why I propose the "Applications sub-forum" - at the top will be a lock-sticky with a list of Individual jobs for what the mod needs (based off of the decisions in the "ideas" thread). In this sub-forum, people can choose a job from the list and "apply" in a new thread, probably with a display of their work regarding the area in question - if it's a building they mean to work on, then they should show a pic of a good building they've made, to show their skill in that area.

This is another important reason for the "Ideas forum" where anyone is free to give suggestions/ideas, and concept art - this way newbies could contribute to the mod as well, even if their modding skills weren't exactly mod-worthy.

If the whole community indeed contributes, there's going to be a great variety of submitted ideas, and we need a way to be able to address them all and decide whether or not to use them in the mod, and this appeared to be a big problem with the PPM mod-
but setting it up the way I propose should solve this issue.

[Aztek985]

You know, I am always reachable through MSN, but nobody tried to contact me! I will make your forum, and you have my support on this mod. Good luck.

[Team Black]

Thank you very much, Python - yeah sorry I didn't contact you sooner on msn, which is probably what I should've done in the first place XD

Alright looks like we have a mod!

[Clazzy]

There are many reasons why PPM (as a mod) is how it is. For s tart, many of the members left the community. This could perhaps be a major reason why, there's blatantly no sarcasm here and if there is we should all act shocked.

Another point could be the fact that Banshee was too caught up in working with Revora since he is quite an important member when it comes to that.

As well, general interest in the community has been lost as time goes by due to new C&C games or because people get older and obtain real lives. Don't blame PPM because of visible flaws in the mod, chances are they happened because of the modders themselves rather than anything else, not because of the way the mod was structured.

By the way, you do realise the massive disadvantage if the whole community works together. There will be a massive discontinuity with the mod since every modder makes a map/voxel/SHP differently to everybody else and nothing will fit together. There are advantages and disadvantages to having a large amount of members working together on a mod, please take them into account.

(Am drunk when posting this, I do apologise for any typos/violent responses.

[Robo fish]

I Am drunk when posting this, I do apologise for any typos/violent responses.

Heh
If we start a mod, then I will give you map support. Count on me.

[Team Black]

@ Clazzy - I wasn't exactly in the community to see the PPM in action, so I drew all my conclusions from just looking over the topics in the TFD forum.

As far as the continuity thing, I agree with you to some degree - but I also don't think it as an issue as we'd expect, since there aren't a real lot of people in the tibweb community...
but we'll just have to see how it plays out.

I'm trying something different, OK, and yea I appreciate your wanting to keep it somewhat down to earth -
I appreciate concerns and criticism...but try not no shoot me down OK, a little support wouldn't exactly hurt either . . .

This post has been edited by Team Black: May 21 2007, 01:48 AM

[Clazzy]

I've seen far more skilled teams come together to work on a mod and fail, I would have hoped the mere fact that I'm posting (considering how rarely I give out advice) is a sign that I'm being supportive.

[Team Black]

what I've noticed though is that you're giving me all the reasons why it should fail, and no suggestions on how to get around it, save for abandoning the entire project completely. This is what I mean by 'trying to shoot me down'.

But yes, I do see your point, and I'm indeed welcome to accept whatever advice you're willing to give OK

[Lightstorm]

we should annouce that we've started this mod on PPM and that if they don't get their butts in gear with their mod we'll beat them.

[Team Black]

Banshee's waiting for better modding stuff - the inproved auto-normals thing, better shp maker, and stable version of ETS (like that'll happen )
yeah.