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More flying building expiramentation |
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Jun 28 2007, 12:29 AM
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Core Defender
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We know that we can't use actual aircraft, since they don't follow deploy logic- but there are a few ways to make aircraft out of vehicles: 1st idea: adjust the hover locomotor. Reading through Jah's heli research, I thought I'd give my own shot at it (I wasn't expecting to succeed where he had failed - rather, just to know for myself what does and doesn't work) By adjusting the HoverHeight for the hover loco, you can make a convincing looking aircraft, with the ability to deploy. There are many minuses (which are described in Jah's thread), but they can all be overcome with some tweaking. However, there is a key issue that remains: cliff passability. By making the terrain CODE ; cliffs [Rock] Foot=0% Track=0% Wheel=0% Float=0% Hover=100% Amphibious=0% Buildable=no it does not enable the unit to descend or ascend cliffs, only to move on them in the same level.
livin_on_the_edge.PNG ( 96.67K )
Number of downloads: 4 This also causes some compliance issues with hover units- it's difficult to get them to go places, especially if a cliff is involved in the process. VERDICT: using the hover logic is phayl. 2nd idea: make the vehicle fly. this is done by giving it an aircraft's locomotor, SpeedType=winged, and MovementZone=fly. This method allows for aircraft to support every logic that vehicles support: deploying, passengers, hva animation, shp, turrets, etc. The cons: It is invincible during flight - unless it runs into a firestorm wall (not even hunter-seekers can get em) It can't reveal shroud while in flight - but this might not be a big problem, if we make them MoveToShroud=no. it can be picked up by carryalls - but I wouldn't really see that as a gameplay-threatening issue
invincible_balloon.PNG ( 40.93K )
Number of downloads: 3The invincibility thing might be balanced if we make em go really really slow, but even then, ehhhhhhh If we were to make mobile buildings though, this would be the best way to do it (unless the exe hackers feel like getting planes able to deploy/undeploy. . .) MY VERDICT: flying buildings in TS would be great, but it isn't going to happen. Even if it did work, it would already throw the game's balance to heck. So what now? I'd hate to say it, but I'm leaning towards ditching the mobile buildings altogether, but I'm going to need some feedback before I decide anything...
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Jun 28 2007, 10:19 AM
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Stealth Tank
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idea 1. i don't see a way how this should work. idea 2. this would be only possible with map triggers. If you want the human player to control the Scrin, he/she can't use this feature, or only with some annoying complications.
imo we should use the flying vehicles, even if they are invincible. The explanation could be that Scrin ships have strong shields while they fly, and are only vulnerable while deployed or on ground. And due to the fact, that all flying vehicles (Buildings) are unarmed, it's not that much imbalanced. This way they are quite the same as subterranean units. They can't be stopped too, without emp.
And the armed Scrin ships can then use the (high flying) Hover logic. The flying height should be low enough to explain why they can't cross cliffs.
list of Flying vehicles: 4-5 Scrin Base Buildings/Ships 1-2 deploy-to-fire Attack ships 1 Scrin troop transport (couterpart to the sub-apc)
list of hover units: -scrin heavy cruiser -scrin harvester? (with a cool energy-stream animation that beams tiberium up into the harvester; refinery designed so it looks like the harvester would let the tiberium fall into the refinery while flying over it)
list of normal aircrafts -scrin fighter -scrin bomber
This post has been edited by Lin Kuei Ominae: Jun 28 2007, 10:37 AM
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Jun 28 2007, 01:20 PM
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Stealth Tank
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would you then give the undeployed building speed=0 so the player is forced to use the carryall? can the player build additional carryalls from the warfactory? if you want for each building a different carryall, do all these are available in the warfactory too? (seems a bit redundant if there appear 4 or 5 different carryalls) how do you want to avoid a small carryall from a small building to carry away the biggest building. The main reason why i don't like this, is because this doesn't supports the idea of the scrin having spaceships. The only way i would accept your idea is, if the carryall looks like an spaceship enginesection, that picks up/docks with the spaceship. But for that, each Spaceship should have the same size or is designed in a way, so that on all ships the uienginesection layout is the same. Because i really don't want 4 or 5 different carryalls, while you can not avoid the smallest one carrying the biggest ship having some very ugly graphical errors (engines in the middle of a ship etc). QUOTE (Lightstorm @ Jun 28 2007, 01:03 PM) wait can you undeploy a building first built in the construction yard? we need to check that afaik this works. the conyard can be build as a building and then undeployed into the unit. If not we can overcome this using Freeunit tags on invisible dummy buildings. This way the construction buildup anim can be even different from the deploy buildup anim. copying code from RA2 to TS is very hard. i don't think we find someone who can do this. So we have to work with the things, the TS engine supports.
This post has been edited by Lin Kuei Ominae: Jun 28 2007, 01:25 PM
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Jun 28 2007, 03:47 PM
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Core Defender
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Yeah, there's no way to limit what a carryall can pick up - it's all or nothing. Carryall=yes or Carryall=no Also, when you make something a FreeUnit (like a harv comes wtih a refinnery) it makes that unit into a VEHICLE, regardless if it's coded as an infantry or aircraft (it's kind of funny to see infantry acting like vehicles, too ). We already know that vehicle-aircraft are invincible during flight, and can't reveal shroud - they also can't act like a carryall (yup, I tested it) In RA2, they got rid of traditional aircraft logic, save for Harriers and Boris's MIG's. Their aircraft were actually vehicles, which is why they came out of the war factory - that's what made them able to deploy, carry passengers, animate their rotors, etc. Also known as, idea #2 from the first post. The only thing is, they were able to make them reveal shroud, and not be invincible to weapons, whereas in TS, there's no good way to get around that issue, unless we have some good exe hacking ability, and lots of time. I'm thinking that idea #2 might not be that bad after all, if we make the buildings slow enough, invincibility might not be as much of an issue - and, we can give em a roxorz hva animation XD
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Jun 28 2007, 03:57 PM
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Light Tank
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ooh then you skip a carryall for the scrin side
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Jul 12 2007, 03:04 AM
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Core Defender
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No need for EXE hacks, Miss Lights in my "Aircraft Breakthrough" thread, it describes a way of making RA2-style deploying, animated, infantry-carrying, turtet-wielding aircraft, and though they are invulnurable to normal weapons, they can still be shot down by railgun-type weapons, so these are totally practical! Yea, mobile buildings are a %100 possibility now - deployable as ever! Looks like we can keep em after all
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Jul 12 2007, 04:11 PM
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Attack Buggy
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but, the scrin should have one building on the ground that acts like the mcv.Its like a beacon and the other buildings cant go more than say 50 spaces away but their will be range towers that amplify the range of it to increase distance. and i could throw together an AArail gun
This post has been edited by Roadwarrior: Jul 12 2007, 04:12 PM
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I shall confuse you all! Muhahahahaha!****Updated Mar 20 2008**** Don't forget to comment Voxels: UH-1 Huey SpotlightedPossible mods i will make for Tibsun: CnC:Terminator:Judgment Day
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Jul 12 2007, 04:20 PM
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Attack Buggy
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it would balance it i think
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I shall confuse you all! Muhahahahaha!****Updated Mar 20 2008**** Don't forget to comment Voxels: UH-1 Huey SpotlightedPossible mods i will make for Tibsun: CnC:Terminator:Judgment Day
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